Boss Your Business - The Podcast

Yvonne Heimann [00:00:01]:
Have you ever felt overwhelmed by the countless decisions you have to make as an entrepreneur? Today, we're diving into the struggles many business owners face with decision fatigue and the paralyzing effect it can have on your business growth. First, there's the pressure to always appear certain and confident. Then, there's the never-ending stream of choices that can lead to full on mental exhaustion and burnout. And of course, there's the challenge of balancing emotional well-being with effective decision-making. Joining me today to explore these issues is Jodi Hume, an on-call decision support expert with years of experience in facilitating crucial business decisions. Jodi's unique background in neuroscience and psychology gives her incredible insights into how the brain works under stress and how to navigate those high-stake moments in business. In this episode of Boss Your Business, we'll dive into Jodi's journey, unravel her methods, and discuss practical strategies for boosting your decision-making skills. Expect to gain clarity and confidence in your entrepreneurial journey, making those tough choices a bit more manageable.

Yvonne Heimann [00:01:23]:
And with that, I want to welcome Jodi. I am so happy to have you here today, and I get to nerd out with you. And my favorite question always is, tell my audience what you do today, and how did you get here? Did little Jodie actually think you're gonna do what you're doing today?

Jodi Hume [00:01:47]:
Yeah. Little Jodie had no idea. Well, that's not true. That she didn't know what exactly what she wanted to do or didn't have any idea. That's not quite true. But grown up Jodi can absolutely see the path, how it all makes sense in retrospect. It really isn't as random as it felt, but it was not a clear shot path. The first thing I ever remember wanting to be was a brain surgeon.

Jodi Hume [00:02:09]:
But that had nothing to do in retrospect, that had nothing to do with being a surgeon. I had just read somewhere that when they touched certain parts of your brain, that you would cry or have some sort of reaction, those kinds of things. And I am a huge neuroscience nerd, so it makes perfect sense. It wasn't the surgery part. It was just the fascination with the brain, and that some things are, you know, biological, and other things are experiential. And so that has always been a fascination of mine and why people do what they do and how they experience what they do. So that makes perfect sense. Then I went through a brief phase.

Jodi Hume [00:02:44]:
I went into college to be an engineering major and then switched to a psychology major, which sounds like a big switch, but to me, they sort of feel the same, because they're both about, why does this thing work the way it does? How do you solve problems? I mean, they use, to me, they feel very, very similar. So that wasn't a huge switch. I did think I was going to go back to school for grad school and to become some sort of psychology something. I don't know exactly what, but I had a really, like a lot of people, you get a job, and it just becomes a bunch of other things. And that created this whole other path, which I'm happy to elaborate on. But the most interesting thing, a lot of times I will tell people, is there's not a single thing I get paid to do now that I even knew existed until I was 30, 35, even maybe, I'm 50 now.

Jodi Hume [00:03:31]:
So I definitely did not chart my course in this direction. It's very much a me shaped discovery process of where my strengths really are. I was at an architecture firm for about 15 years as we grew from 8 to 50 people, so about 1 million to about 10, 12 million by the time I left. Absolutely was a big part of navigating that growth with the leadership team. And then I went and got trained as a facilitator first and then as a coach. And that really started my initial path in the direction I am right now, which was coaching and facilitation. And in a lot of ways, I'm still doing a lot of facilitation, still doing coaching, but to me, it feels like a derivation of coaching. The business I run now is sort of an offset of coaching.

Jodi Hume [00:04:22]:
It's almost more like individual facilitation. I call it on call decision support. I find that entrepreneurs often know what they need. They don't need a coach. They don't need a consultant. They don't need an advisor. Like, they know deep down, like, nobody knows your business better than you do. And so they need someone to listen for that and to pull it out of them and be curious and not just jump in with my immediate thought, based on my experience, I want to pull out what they know and then sometimes identify, like, okay, here is a knowledge gap.

Jodi Hume [00:04:50]:
Maybe this is something you need to learn more, or here is a place you're indecisive, that we need to dump a thing out or make a spreadsheet or solve some legitimate, like, business issue. And then sometimes they're just exhausted. And this comes back to the neuroscience thing. You cannot make a good decision when you are run down or emotionally hijacked. And so that that diagnostic piece of what is really the core problem here, that's my sweet spot. More than the kind of coaching where you leave the call with the homework assignment to do something differently that just never landed for me.

Yvonne Heimann [00:05:27]:
And for everybody just listening. You haven't seen my face through this because it's like, it's so interesting to me how the universe always delivers with my podcast guests while I'm growing, while I'm changing, while my message is changing, because it's like I'm sitting here and I'm like, oh, my God. Yes, yes, yes. I literally went on Instagram, rant yesterday, yesterday, where I'm like, I am so tired of coaches saying, it's black and white. Here's what worked for me. It's gonna work for you. I'm like, bullshit people.

Jodi Hume [00:06:05]:
And, in fact. And in fact, it's part of what has made, you know, I've been doing this now for almost. Well, yeah, for 20 years. And there were so many times it was so frustrating because I can't follow the standard kind of marketing things of how to grow your business with, like, a. Like, a little lead Mac, and a top five things you should know. I'm like, I can't. Because two people, even if two people have similar businesses and a similar problem, that doesn't mean what they should do in that moment is the same. Like, it's never the same.

Jodi Hume [00:06:40]:
So I can't say, here's what you should do in this circumstance. I have at least five more questions before I could give any kind of insight on that or help you figure something else out. It's always so different. And so I don't teach one thing that I could do a course on, that I could sell forever in the background. You know, it is. It. It is a very tricky thing, but I know it's the right thing. And so I've just really stuck my flag in the ground about staying strong on, like, no, this is what I know.

Jodi Hume [00:07:08]:
Entrepreneurs. I'm a third generation entrepreneur, and so I know what entrepreneurs need. And so that is really how I have just stalwartly crafted my business and the model and the whole structure around that.

Yvonne Heimann [00:07:20]:
And I love how you said entrepreneurs usually know what they need in the moment. And it's just like, it's. Maybe it's an external validation where it's like, okay, I'm not feeling 100% myself right now. Imposter syndrome, whatever it is, I just need somebody to tell me, you freaking know what to do. Just go do it. Or where it's, like, helping. I'm assuming your clients are probably similar than me often, where it's like, I have so many things going on in my head, and I don't know how to take all of the things that are happening all at the same time in the 10,000 tabs in my head and concise them down. And it's like you're just a translator giving back to say, is that what you just said in one sentence? You took ten minutes to say that.

Yvonne Heimann [00:08:10]:
But.

Jodi Hume [00:08:16]:
I mean, this is. This is. I think it's true for all entrepreneurs, but it is, like, exponentially true for anyone who is a verbal processor. Like, I am a verbal processor. Not everyone is. I know some people who simply were like, people pay you to do what? Like, if you are just. If you process in your own head, it may not be as important. There are still times you need to bounce things off of other people.

Jodi Hume [00:08:35]:
But especially if you're a verbal processor, it's almost like watching someone else parallel park a car. Like, sometimes they just need to say the thing. You nailed it. Like, a lot of times they just need to hear. So I'll back up one step from that. I'm sure you've seen this as well. Rarely are there right answers, like when, especially if you were doing something that no one else has ever done before. I'm not actually a huge believer in the right answer.

Jodi Hume [00:09:04]:
You just have to make sure it's not the wrong answer and at least wrong answer as possible. Take action. You continue to course correct. And so sometimes, you know, when something can feel a little bit more high stakes, you just, it's not like they're calling me like I'm some sort of oracle. That's like, oh, that is the correct answer. It's just like, yeah, I think you have. I hear that you have thought this through enough. You've explored all the options.

Jodi Hume [00:09:30]:
I don't hear any major red flags there. I think you're good. And then they have that, like, clarity and confidence to just take action. And that gets harder and harder as, as you grow a company because there are fewer and fewer people you can talk to. You know, I've seen a lot of my companies, a lot of my clients are startup founders. And so a lot of times the people that they had used for guidance and talking things through will suddenly be an investor in their company, especially if they've done like a friends and family round. Well, then that gets harder.

Yvonne Heimann [00:10:00]:
Certain things, you don't want to have the conversation with them. It's, yeah, yeah.

Jodi Hume [00:10:05]:
Or just maybe even if you can, but you kind of want to have it with someone else first to tidy it up a bit and maybe shave off some of the weird edges. You know, I have one client who I think something a lot back to the neuroscience. A lot of people don't understand that. We talk a lot about executive functioning, things like prioritizing and strategizing and visioning and all these things that make a good decision, like that part of the brain a lot of people are very familiar with. But there are prerequisites to executive functioning, which is emotional and energetic regulation. Like if you were emotionally hijacked or if you were exhausted, that part of your brain to do all those other things is not going to work as well. And so, you know, I have a client who's really clear on that. And so she calls me first when the emotions, she says to burn off some of the emotion.

Jodi Hume [00:10:55]:
And so that when she goes back to her team, she's not taking them on this crazy ride of her ups and downs and lefts and rights. And she's like, I got to get clear, and I have to get grounded and I have to get focused, and then I can go be a good leader. And that is not some, like, weird, indulgent thing. Neither is the. I don't even talk about it in terms of rest because entrepreneurs are terrible at resting. I just, I talk about it in terms of recharging. Like, how do you also, they're not good at passive rest. Like, that is just a stupid conversation to have with any entrepreneur.

Yvonne Heimann [00:11:28]:
Oh, my God. Yes.

Jodi Hume [00:11:30]:
We have to find the types of active rest that recharge us. Like, for me, it's walking in the forest. I can go walk in the forest for 45 minutes. I come out a different person afterwards than when I walked in other. But if I try to lay down and take a nap or veg out, forget it. Not happening.

Yvonne Heimann [00:11:50]:
When it's a day off on the couch, you know, it's been a week. It's been a week. My body is literally like, I'm done, and it's going to be some stupid thing on tv that I don't have to follow or understand. And that means, girl, you burnt the candle on both ends.

Jodi Hume [00:12:12]:
Yep. And that, and that. Sometimes that's necessary. You know, I'm not against working hard. It's. But I am also really loyal to the science of what we know scientifically that the brain needs to function at its capacity. And it very much flies in the face of a lot of hustle. Culture or it's lonely at the top, like, a lot of leadership platitudes are just staunchly ignoring the proven science about what your brain and your biology needs to function at its best.

Yvonne Heimann [00:12:43]:
And it's like that's where it comes back around again to our individuality and not, it's like, I've experienced so many, so many coaches as of life. It's like, again, everything shows up when you need it, right? The, the master appears when the student is ready, where it's like, I've seen so many teach based on what they've learned. And, yes, it's a starting point. I'm like, hey, here's something that worked. Let's figure out how this potentially can work for you. But I often see that piece missing of let's see how it works for you. 05:00 a.m. club yeah, it can work.

Yvonne Heimann [00:13:20]:
Hustle. Yeah, it can work in season. It all can work. But coming back around to your physiology, your, your mental toughness, where are you at in your mental growth? Where you with your business? What are your, your core values? Where are things going. So I'm like, I am so excited to have you on the podcast, because it's like, it's. It's all these gray zones of, yes, it all works, but how does it work for you, really, having those conversations, asking the right questions? It's not always just for our clients to ask the right questions. It's also for coaches and consultants to ask the right questions.

Jodi Hume [00:14:00]:
Oh, curiosity is absolutely, like, probably my most used. Like, I. It's. It wouldn't be. It wouldn't be correct to say, I pretend like I don't know anything. But I did learn very, very, very early on that. That what I used to consider stupid questions or obvious questions, that in regular conversation, there's some, what are you gonna call it? Joy in, or, like, points in being like, oh, yeah, I know what you mean by that. I had to rewrite that script because some of my absolutely most profound work with people was when I just said, oh, what was that? Like? Here's the really interesting thing.

Jodi Hume [00:14:45]:
I had just recently kind of come to this awareness through my own experience in a personal situation that I had had where something had happened to me that everyone in the world just assumed was a great thing, was wonderful. And I had someone respond to that and say, oh, how do you feel about that? And my whole body was just like, actually, I will be happy about it, but right now, not so happy about it. And I am just like. And about a week later, and again, this is a bit of a personal situation, but it applies to businesses. I had a client on the line, and I said, how are you? We were just kind of catching up at the beginning. And she said, I just. She's like, she's like, I'm okay. I actually had a miscarriage yesterday.

Jodi Hume [00:15:30]:
And I started. It was a phone call. It's back in the days of only phone calls. I started to say, oh, I'm so sorry. And I just paused, and I said, how do you feel about that? And I kid you not, I cringed because I felt like that was a terrible thing to say. Like, almost offensive. I was, like, testing it out. And there was this long pause during which I got more nervous that it was a terrible question.

Jodi Hume [00:15:50]:
And she said, and she had tears. And she said, thank you so much for the question. She said, I am actually really okay with it. I am happy. She's like, but I feel like a terrible person that I'm. She's like, I wasn't really sure I wanted this right now. And we had this whole really important conversation. She said, this is the only place I've been able to express that feeling.

Yvonne Heimann [00:16:15]:
And everybody reacts with the perception that this is a bad thing.

Jodi Hume [00:16:20]:
And once somebody showers you, in her case, with the sadness, in my case, it was with the joy, then you feel even worse being like, actually, like, you can't insert that. So it really closes off what you're able to experience. And while those are personal examples, I actually believe that it is even more true in business, because for business owners, a lot of them feel like the only thing they are ever allowed to talk about or express is that everything's great, that they not only is everything great and everything's growing, and that they're making money and that the team is doing great, and they also have to know exactly where they're headed and what's going to happen next. There is.

Yvonne Heimann [00:17:03]:
Because that's also true, right?

Jodi Hume [00:17:06]:
It's not true for anyone. That's the funny thing about it. Everybody knows that it's never like that. And yet there's this huge weird, like, taboo gap, or has been a big taboo gap. I am absolutely starting to see this change a lot of times. For many, many. For most of the two decades I was doing this, you would only hear about someone's dip into the pit when they were telling the story of their great hero's journey back out of the other side and how it all came together at the end, and that those stories are wonderful. I have nothing against them, but that still creates this bubble where in the moment before you come out, some other side, you're allowed to just either be having a terrible time or honestly, I think, worse.

Jodi Hume [00:17:55]:
Just not know what's wrong. You know, it's just like, this is. Something's not working. I don't even know what the right question is. Not to mention what the answer to that question is. To be floundering is a really, like, there's a lot of shame and embarrassment around that with people, but if you can't talk about it, you can't fix it. And so I was really determined to make a space where you could come and be completely honest about how you were feeling, what you're up against, what you don't know. The number of times I've had clients use this space to have burn it down conversations because they need to be able to go through, and a lot of times, that's not what they need.

Jodi Hume [00:18:38]:
There's just some other recharging, or there's a role that they need in their organization that once they get that person into place, then everything feels better. I never know what the answer is, but I know that the conversation has to happen, and then you can figure out the answer. And one time the answer was, let's burn it down like it's time for business hospice. Let's just work it out. It is time, but most of the time, that's not even what has to happen, but the conversation needs to happen.

Yvonne Heimann [00:19:05]:
And it's like, I love this space and the idea so much of being able to share a. A bad story or a struggling story or a we are not through yet story while it's happening. Did I mention universe has a funny timing with my guests? Because I've literally experienced it, and it's like I am supposed to tell people how to run their business. Yet three months ago, I went from 20k months to barely anything and been struggling with fully sharing it. I've shared pieces of it, I shared a little bit of it, but the public perception is still Yvi is doing great.

Jodi Hume [00:19:53]:
Yeah. Which then makes it even harder to be. And I think what's interesting is I've had clients dabble into trying to talk to people about something, whether it's exactly that kind of thing or something. But because people are so attached to their parasocial impression of, they're like, oh, they just sort of blow it off and don't. It's almost like they refuse to hear it. And so when they even have. It's not always that. There is.

Jodi Hume [00:20:20]:
There aren't people who would listen if they really get it, but sometimes they blow it off because they're like, oh, no, no, my story of you is this. And so therefore, that's all I can really hear. And there's something really lovely about, you know, being seen and heard and the person not even trying to fix it be like, wow, that. That must be really hard. That must be scary. Like, how does that feel? Like, who knows? You might be like, actually, it's kind of a blessing because I was thinking about closing down anyway, but it was so hard when I was making all this money. And, I mean, I can make up a reason when maybe it was the best thing in the world that suddenly your revenue tanked.

Yvonne Heimann [00:20:57]:
And I'm seeing the shift. I'm seeing. I'm starting to come out of this dump of that, of that low, of seeing a why it had to happen, because it's like, I knew the things I needed to do. However, I was so comfortable in that specific situation that I didn't do the things I knew I needed to do to do the shift that I wanted to do in my business. Looking back now, starting that up again, and I see why it had to happen. But it's like I went in exactly the same issues where I reached out to the people I had in my life that I was paying to literally be there in those moments, not understanding that when I say I went from 20k months to literally my mom paying my rent and not hearing me, where it's like, what's how?

Jodi Hume [00:22:00]:
Yeah.

Yvonne Heimann [00:22:01]:
And then there is that. That public on social media where it's like, okay, how much of this am I actually sharing? Because I didn't do what I teach my clients to do, which is why I'm in this situation right now. I'm taking ownership. But it's like, huh, this is why I'm telling you to do this, because I just burned it down, not doing it.

Jodi Hume [00:22:23]:
There's that, but there's also, like, you know, talking about how the universe sort of, like, arranges things in a certain way. There is an. There is an equal and opposite set of skill sets that you need as an entrepreneur, which is, it's not just building but rebuilding. And that is a. Rebuilding is a different set of skills than just building. And it. And you can't teach that if you haven't done it. Like, recovery is a different kind of muscle set.

Jodi Hume [00:22:50]:
And I just. I have yet to see an example where the thing you go through doesn't end up being a really important next piece of the jigsaw puzzle that is part of what you're here to bestow to other people. You know, you were always, you know, a few paces down some path that someone else is coming, coming down. And so it's all learning that you can pass on back down the pathway. So.

Yvonne Heimann [00:23:22]:
And it's like the. The mental growth and the mental exercises I have done over the last two to three weeks, to not go into full on panic mode to. To survive this and not give into all of the BS that was going on in my head. Oh, my God. Yes. I will have a tool belt of resources coming out of this again. Right.

Jodi Hume [00:23:45]:
There's also another piece that I think is really important, which is if you're in any kind of business where you are guiding or helping people, I have seen over and over again that the thing you teach, you will have to. You will continue to struggle with in some way, whether it's, in your case, like, coming down, so you come back up, whatever it is, or you will continue to have different kinds of challenges in that. And I think part of the reason why is because it's so important for your empathy to stay fresh. Like, if you just taught a thing and you never had a struggle with it again, it's just way too easy to be like, why aren't you doing the things? Because you forget sometimes how it feels and what it feels like to try and do the things. When you are pushing off a panic, that's different than when you're just like, just do the things. Why aren't you doing the things? So I have found, at least in my case, that I sometimes get dealt those. Not that specific blow, but, like, that blow and other blows, a whole closet of different kinds of blows when I. Because someone in the universe was like, oh, she needs some fresh empathy.

Jodi Hume [00:25:01]:
She needs to relearn what it's like to do that part and have a little bit fresher skin on what that's like so.

Yvonne Heimann [00:25:10]:
Oh, my God. Yes, I still hear you on that one. It's like, again, we are. We are getting the cards dealt. The universe always knows what we need, even if we don't want it in the moment. And with that, tell my audience when they're ready to actually go, take this, go get your balance and go get your rest, and go get your support in and go get a space where they can be them. Let my audience know where can they find you? And I think you also got a freebie for them to go figure out that rest thing a little bit better.

Jodi Hume [00:25:50]:
I do, I do, I. So this is really funny. All of a sudden, I am blanking on the URL, so give me a hot second.

Yvonne Heimann [00:26:00]:
And that's the nice thing about having shoulders, right? It's the forward slash listener.

Jodi Hume [00:26:02]:
Listener.

Yvonne Heimann [00:26:05]:
However, we are making it really easy for the audience. So you don't even need to know the URL because it's gonna be in the description.

Jodi Hume [00:26:11]:
Thank you so much. I'm super dyslexic, and things like that sometimes just literally fall out of the side of my brain. I'm like, I think it's listener, or it might be listeners. So anyway, you have the link, but there you will find a number of things. There's a free. There's, like, a workbook on how to recharge as an entrepreneur. It's based on the seven kinds of rest. I find it really valuable.

Jodi Hume [00:26:30]:
Back to that thing. We don't rest well there, actually. I scan these seven kinds of rests that I saw TED talk on one time, because I'll be like, oh, that's what I need. I need social rest, you know, or I need. I need technological, like electronic rest. Like, there's just creative rest. Like, there's just different kinds of, like, access points for recharging. And that's a great place to kind of remind myself of different ways that I can recharge.

Jodi Hume [00:26:58]:
So that's a great little workbook. There's also several ways there that you can. I believe it's a 50% discount on any single session with me. So that's there. I add more things to that page all the time, so I don't even remember what's there right now. But you can keep looking. There might be more stuff later. I also, if anyone ever wants to just go to schedulejodi.com, which is Jodi with an I, there is a link there for a connection call, which is a free 30 or 45 minutes call just to chat, ask a question.

Jodi Hume [00:27:28]:
It's kind of an ask me anything.

Yvonne Heimann [00:27:30]:
That is a tongue twister, though. I do the same thing.

Jodi Hume [00:27:32]:
It really is. It really. That's the first time I've ever gotten stuck on it. But ask me anything, kind of a check in, and I'm always happy, happy to do those. So.

Yvonne Heimann [00:27:42]:
And as you guys know, it's always in the show description to make it really easy for you to just go click the button. No need to figure out how it's spelled or how it's done. Jodi, thank you so much for joining me today. And the universe always delivers with the right lessons

Jodi Hume [00:28:00]:
Thank you for having me. It was lovely.

Yvonne Heimann [00:28:03]:
Bye, everybody. Bye.