She Is A Leader - The Podcast

Yvonne Heimann [00:00:00]:
In today's episode with Gabs Hayes, we explore how she transformed from corporate rule follower to a digital nomad CEO. While raising three children and creating the genuine freedom to live life. Gabs is sharing her journey of being a slow nomad, moving to a new state like every couple of years with her family, sometimes out of necessity and sometimes just to get out of the everyday rut of just being a human. After losing her son, Gabs experienced that profound awakening that led her to question everything. Whose life am I living? Whose dream am I chasing? This wake up call mirrors my own experience after losing my husband, where we both began to reevaluate what truly matters. What makes Gabs story so powerful is her honesty about shutting down her seven figure consulting firm because despite the financial success, it wasn't creating the life she wanted. She now structures her business around her family needs, incorporating regular mini sabbaticals to batch work and remain fully present when she is with her family and when she is supporting clients. Our conversation in this episode really highlights the importance of creating a safe space where entrepreneurs can be vulnerable and authentic.

Yvonne Heimann [00:01:44]:
And as Gabs says, did I create a safe enough space where people could be themselves, as raw, as real and as ugly as we sometimes are, but also as freaking proud and excited for the things we've accomplished? For anyone feeling trapped in their business or wanting more freedom, this conversation shows that success doesn't require constant hustle. It's about designing a business that truly works and supports the life you want. And with that, I want to introduce you to Gabs. Gabs actually got recommended to me to come on by another podcast guest of mine. I loved having Brianna on to introduce you to Gabs. First of all, you were climbing actually the corporate ladder way back when and sounds like you kind of experienced that whole losing yourself in every step and then your side hustle became kind of like your secret escape, bringing that passion back that you thought was lost. I feel you on that one. Feel you on that one.

Yvonne Heimann [00:03:11]:
And then what started as that creative outlet grew to something extraordinary. You suddenly had built that seven figure business while juggling consulting Nomad lifestyle. I already want to dive. Everybody listening. I already want her. We're going to dive into this deeper a little bit and raising three kids girl, today. Just so you guys know what's happening today, Gabs has not only created a freedom to fully embrace entrepreneurship, but also retired. Her husband travels with her family and helps founders turn their Sunday into a right now reality.

Yvonne Heimann [00:03:54]:
So we're not just doing dreams and planning and pictures on the wall. No we are getting shit done. This unconditional path has taught Gabs that you don't have to choose between success and flexibility. You can design a business that gives you both. And anybody that has listened to even just one of my podcast episodes, you know, we are speaking the same language. So you going from corporate consultant to digital nomad CEO, your journey shows that your dream life isn't just possible, it's practical. So she's here to show us how to build a business that fits your lifestyle and not the other way around. And I knew how, and Brianna was sending somebody over that they're first of all, top notch and speaking my language, but reading through your information, I'm like, girl, we need to chat.

Gabs Hayes [00:04:51]:
We need to chat.

Yvonne Heimann [00:04:53]:
You do all this with three kids?

Gabs Hayes [00:04:57]:
I do. My kids are 4, 8 and almost 14. So I've got a big range. And we, we pack them up and roll them with us when it's time to move on to the next place.

Yvonne Heimann [00:05:10]:
Now I'm like, I. First of all, for me, I come from Germany, right? I'm like, everything is structured. Everything is in a specific way. And I'm like, yeah. Even though I don't have kids and it was never on my plan, I'm still like, damn. I'm like, you are taking kids, you are taking them on the road with you. You. You are changing locations.

Yvonne Heimann [00:05:36]:
And part in the entrepreneur part of me is like, oh, hell yeah, learn by doing rather than just out of a book. And the German in me is like, holy crap, how the hell do you manage all that? So I'm like, I want to know how does. How does this look like on an everyday life?

Gabs Hayes [00:05:54]:
Yeah. You know, I think I always like to classify with people. We are slow nomads. And so that was one of the questions I asked you before we started recording is like, how quickly are you popping kind of from place to place? Because I think for a lot of people, when they hear the word, like, digital nomad, they think, oh, you hang out somewhere for a week or two and then you move on somewhere else. And as much as in my mind, that sounds incredible. We've not yet done that. We kind of hang out somewhere for like a year or two and then we move on somewhere else. So to kind of put some context behind that, in the last 10 years, we've lived in six different states.

Gabs Hayes [00:06:25]:
So if that kind of helps put some context there. And really some of it has been out of necessity. We've had to. We've had a child with medical challenges that has had to just physically relocate for proper care. And so sometimes it's like, like you said, you're just getting shit done. This isn't working anymore. We throw what we can in suitcases and put it in the car and go. And we will deal with the rest later.

Gabs Hayes [00:06:48]:
Um, and then there's been times where it's like, why the hell not? Like, the world is out there and it's ours to explore. And I remember the first move we made. My husband and I were both born and raised in Atlanta, Georgia. And after we got married, we were decided to move to Denver, Colorado. And it was that eye opening. Like, I cannot believe this is the same country I have lived in my entire life. And so it was like, if I feel that way in one state, imagine how it is to go in another and another and another and another and to just keep testing out different cultures and experiences and, you know, weather patterns and just schools and, you know what I mean? There's so much out there. And I think truthfully, part of it has been, it has supported so much of this kind of self awareness journey that entrepreneurship has given me, where it's like, who do I really want to be and what do I really want my life to look like? And a huge part of that is complacency, is not it? And so for me to just put my feet or my head in the sand and say, this is where I am and this is what life looks like, that hasn't been it for us.

Gabs Hayes [00:07:56]:
It's been keep going until we find the place where we finally feel like it's home. And we just haven't quite found that yet.

Yvonne Heimann [00:08:02]:
And it's like for anybody listening that might not follow me on social media. I went on a similar journey about a month ago. I packed up my life within two and a half weeks. I sold most of my furniture two and a half weeks, got what the minimalistic. I wanted to take in my car and put everything else in storage. And off I went. And it was nice to hear. I had never, never heard the term of slow digital nomad, of that idea of when we hit digital nomad, it's like, great.

Yvonne Heimann [00:08:34]:
Somebody in their camper van driving around. That's kind of like the picture we have, right? So similar to you, I'm like, I'm nicely stationed with a friend right now because San Diego, similar to you, where it's like San Diego didn't feel like home anymore. It. I felt stagnant, I felt boxed in. I felt no movement. And I'm like, I need to do something. Something needs to change. And then there was the solution.

Yvonne Heimann [00:09:02]:
My business can handle it. I can take it anywhere. So hearing from you, being able to do this, literally with a whole family in tow, I'm like, sweet, awesome. The. The new fresh baby digital nomad and me is like, so do you actually move with furniture, or do you just move into furnished places?

Gabs Hayes [00:09:27]:
We've done both. This last time, we tried desperately to find a furnished place, and we did not. So we ended up with two sets of everything. So that added, you know, a little extra layer. When we decided to sell our last house, it was like, okay, now do we sell all of that furniture? Do we need some of those things? What comes with what doesn't? So, I mean, don't get me wrong, it adds a little chaos to our life, for sure. But I think, you know, when you talk about we became entrepreneurs for a reason, and a lot of that has been because we were attempting to build this. This life and this culture or this lifestyle that we didn't get to experience in our former lives. It wasn't because I just wanted to keep living the same way, and so I couldn't keep doing the same thing I always did and keep staying in my same comfort and then being like, yeah, but I built this business.

Gabs Hayes [00:10:20]:
And so for me, it was like, I'm going to lean all the way in, and it's going to be uncomfortable, and it's going to come with challenges, and it sure as hell is going to be chaotic. And many days of this journey, but on the other side of it, too, it's also been incredibly rewarding. And so that's the beauty of this journey is it's going to have ups and downs. We cannot avoid that. But do I get to ride the ups better, longer, more enjoyably? Because they're ups I chose versus ups that were handed to me. And that's such a different journey, if you ask me.

Yvonne Heimann [00:10:56]:
And I'm. I'm there with you. I'm like, don't get me wrong. I don't just go to go when there's something. I feel it out. Why is that there? What's happening, what's behind it and everything? And then I make my decision. So I'm like, I'm not just leaving a place because whatever. So it's like, I can.

Yvonne Heimann [00:11:19]:
I can so relate. Now I'm curious. Did little Gabs think this is what your life is gonna be? What did she think she's gonna be like when you grow up?

Gabs Hayes [00:11:30]:
Oh, my gosh, no. I mean, I was. I Was such a rule follower. I was such a. Yeah. Do it by the book, right? I mean.

Yvonne Heimann [00:11:42]:
Yes. Not even in the gray zone. Not even halfway off.

Gabs Hayes [00:11:46]:
No. I mean, I. You know, I. I would cry if I got a B in school. And I graduated high school a year early and I started college a year early. And then, you know, it was like I did all these things, and I got married very young, and I had started having kids very young. I was like, I was doing all the, you know, this is the boxes, and I was checking them off. Yep.

Gabs Hayes [00:12:07]:
The supposed tos. And quite frankly, I probably would have continued down that path because while there are parts of it I am very grateful I left behind, there were parts of it that were not all awful. And I think many times we talk a lot about those of us who have left corporate and gone into entrepreneurship, and there's this kind of like, it's a this or that kind of conversation. And I think it's. It's not. I think there's a lot of us that have spent a lot of years in corporate or in a former career, and we loved many parts of it. And then there was a piece of our life that suddenly shook us up, and we were like, wait a second, where am I? Whose life am I living? Whose dream am I chasing? And for me, that was when my son passed away. I woke up and I was like, wait a second, I'm going back to a job.

Gabs Hayes [00:12:53]:
Is it even a job I want? And I'm living in this neighborhood, in this house, and this is even somewhere I want to live. And I have these friends. Are they even friends I want to have? I mean, you just suddenly you start questioning everything. And I think it's actually really healthy. It was really healthy to take a step back and say, is this what I even want anymore? And quite frankly, that's been almost seven years ago. And I do that a lot now in my life. Like, there's a lot of times where I'm like, wait a second, Gabs, is that even what you actually want? Or are you just charging forward because you thought you were supposed to keep moving? You were supposed to keep going, you were supposed to keep making decisions, keep making money, keep moving forward. And maybe it's like you're supposed to just sit down and be for a minute, and then something will reveal itself to you.

Yvonne Heimann [00:13:41]:
I'm getting. I'm getting goosebumps over here because our stories are so similar. My big wake up call was losing my husband. Right? And that was the first time where I'm like, what am I doing with this? What am I doing here? And since then, it's, I'm like, don't get me wrong. I fall into old habits where it's like suddenly, okay, done that again. Let's re evaluate. What am I doing here? Is this actually what I want to do? Is it just a habit? Is it just an autopilot or something that I thought I should be doing? And one of the things that, that I have had a lot of conversations about is like, I would love to be able to trigger that in somebody without the trauma that comes with that wake up call. I'm like, I want you to experience that profound moment of what the fuck am I doing? And it seems to be always coming along with some kind of a trauma.

Yvonne Heimann [00:14:45]:
And I wish I could give that moment, that emotion, that question, that deep seated, this is not me. But what. What is me? Who is me? For others to be able to experience without the trauma attached to it.

Gabs Hayes [00:15:01]:
I think we got a mission we have to solve now because I literally just gave a keynote a couple of months ago and I had this exact conversation. It was a keynote for women and how success is inherently built inside of us. And I said that all the time. Like, I wish more women would just wait. And I think it's for all, all. But women in particular were just so accustomed to, you know, running fast and making decisions and keeping the, keeping the wheels on the train right and keeping it moving that it's like, what is that wake up call? Without having to be jolted to actually wake up.

Yvonne Heimann [00:15:39]:
And my, my idea at some point was going into virtual reality and bringing that in. But then you have the potential of causing a traumatic experience to teach that lesson. Now we are looking at legal issues, so girl, I'm in there. We're going to have to have more conversations off podcast on this one where it's like, it's just a moment of. It's just a profound moment of. I. You are the mom. I'm assuming that having a child could be a similar experience where it's just a.

Yvonne Heimann [00:16:14]:
Huh. Okay, that just happened. What do we do now?

Yvonne Heimann [00:16:20]:
Yeah, let's. Let's see if we can figure something out. To all of you listening and watching, have this experience. Experience, because it really is. It's eye opening. It's changing it. It suddenly is like, why did I give a about this? Let's do that. That sounds way more fun.

Yvonne Heimann [00:16:39]:
And yeah, now I'm curious with all of that. First of all, how you got here. The experience, losing your Son being digital nomad, doing it with a full on family. What does business look like now? How, how are you running your business? How does your everyday look like? How are you embodying that in your business?

Gabs Hayes [00:17:02]:
Yeah, it's been a journey for sure. You know, when I first got into entrepreneurship it was, you know, kind of as my bio shares, it was a side hustle and it was not with intention. And I, you know, I, I spend a lot of my time now working with entrepreneurs to make sure. When you are building your business, are you looking at the intentionality behind it? What do you want it to look like? Because I didn't. I did four years of that constant grind, that hustle, that pushing, that same thing I learned in corporate. I took it with me right into my business. So if you would have asked me even just last year what my business and my day to day looked like, it was ugly, it was awful. I don't recommend it for anyone.

Gabs Hayes [00:17:42]:
It was sun up to sundown and it was a lot of I was there for my family, but I wasn't present for my family. And it was a really hard wake up call for me to even go through in that sense. But when I look at it now, you know, I made a really hard choice in December to shut down that seven figure consulting firm because while it was successful by all stretches of, you know, societal definition, it was not building the life that I intentionally wanted to live. And so I chose to walk away. And I'm now fully supporting entrepreneurs in my company called the bravestart. And now we've built this company specifically so that what I'm preaching to other entrepreneurs in the sense of what do you want your business to look like? Is exactly how I've built it in the sense that I don't need to be on and present 24/7, 365. I have figured out that I myself work best in a batched, focused capacity. So guess what? I build many sabbaticals into my schedule and I go away once a month or once every other month and batch all of my content and all of my outbound activities so that when I am with my business, I'm with it, I'm present, I'm there, I'm building relationships.

Gabs Hayes [00:19:01]:
And so that is what I have learned has worked best for me. And it's been a really unique dynamic for me to say in 2025, I'm really a stay at home mom first and I'm an entrepreneur second. And when you ask me if little Gabs ever thought she was gonna say that that was a. Hell no. I tried being an actual stay at home mom once and that was miserable. So this has been like, you know, really, really interesting to kind of test out this dynamic. But it's what my kids and my family need right now. And so it's what I have pivoted to and it's working really well.

Gabs Hayes [00:19:38]:
And I feel like I'm doing the greatest work of my career because I have figured out what do I want, how do I build that structure and how do I support myself to put myself in an environment of success, to do that work.

Yvonne Heimann [00:19:53]:
So much. Yes. So much. Yes. And I love, I love the piece of, you know what I'm living, what I'm teaching. I think in, in our profession, so much has happened on the. Oh yeah, I'm teaching you while I figure it out myself. Yes.

Yvonne Heimann [00:20:12]:
We all got to figure out. We all grow. We all do. But so many. I've seen the downfall of a lot of coaches back in 2024, actually last year, where on two levels. One, the lower level is like, cool. My clients are the teaching ground and I figure stuff out on your wallet. Or it's the big coaches that haven't lived what they teach in ages and completely just lose the connection to the people they are supposed to be here to help with.

Yvonne Heimann [00:20:50]:
And it's been interesting behind the scenes because I don't, I haven't seen much public communication and, and conversation about it, but I'm like, oh, I know what that coach has done and it's happening behind the scenes. And they laid off 30 of their team. However you teach up here and you're well known, huge edge coach, but you lost so much connection with your clientele that you can't keep your team on board anymore. And then I'm like, oh yeah, you, you haven't even lived what you are selling. So it's been really interesting and it's, it's fun for me because now I tapped into our female business owners, into our female consultants and leaders and coaches to come into our section, our niche where everybody knows everybody and guess what? We live what we preach.

Gabs Hayes [00:21:49]:
Yeah.

Yvonne Heimann [00:21:50]:
It's not just a product, it's not just an offer. It's not just a book smart. What you see is what you get. And I think that's one of the things that's coming up in 2025 where it's like our clientele gets smarter than they already are. Where it's like, I expect more and more of the pseudo coaches to actually lose the traction they have right now because of people like you. It's like I'm living what I'm preaching. Here you go. This is where I'm at right now.

Yvonne Heimann [00:22:22]:
I'm doing it with my family. You can do that too.

Gabs Hayes [00:22:26]:
Yeah. And, you know, it's been hard because I, I mean, I'm with you. I have some of those, you know, big time coaches that I would at, at one point in time in my journey have considered friends or acquaintances. And it's been really hard to watch them just completely lose touch with what I would call reality. But the fact of the matter is, is they've not, they've lost touch with the reality of the audience that they're marketing to, but they have not lost touch with their reality. And so, you know, I find that very interesting when I am talking to, you know, potential customers of mine that they're having a hard time making a decision now because they've been hurt, they've been burned, they've been left. And I sympathize with them. I know exactly how they feel.

Gabs Hayes [00:23:14]:
I have been in their shoes. And so I have no, I have no fears when they have that, that fear. When we're on a sales conversation or, you know, having a conversation about what's next for them, I know exactly how they're coming up and those feelings that are validated for them. But it's also sad because I look at them and I'm like, I know exactly what next step you need to take. I know exactly what next step it's going to take to give you that confidence, confidence back in yourself as an entrepreneur and your confidence back in your business. But I cannot promise you X amount of dollars or X amount of clients, and nor am I going to because that's not your reality. And I'm sorry that there's coaches out there that are still promising you that because it's not true. And it's, it's an interesting dynamic for our industry to go through.

Gabs Hayes [00:24:06]:
And so I appreciate people like you and myself who are like, we're just going to keep being here. I'm going to keep showing up, I'm going to keep being honest. I'm going to keep telling you about my suicidal ideation. And that's the reason why I decided to shut down my consulting firm. I'm going to keep telling you about the launches that I've had that failed and why they failed. And I'm just going to keep talking about these things on my podcast and I'm going to keep talking about them in my content. And when you decide enough is enough and I need someone to get me out of my own way, I'll be here.

Yvonne Heimann [00:24:36]:
Yep. And it's like to wrap this up with a nice rainbow. It's like if somebody promises you as a coach or a consultant, you are going to. Because of the work you do, because it comes down, we are just guiding them. That's all we do. I cannot promise a specific outcome. Yes, I can coach you. Yes, I know how to activate you.

Yvonne Heimann [00:24:57]:
Yes, I know how to get you to take action. But probably just like me, you gonna have to change certain habits. You're gonna have to change certain thought patterns for them to make that change. And if they keep fighting it and they are not going with the flow, we can't promise. I can tell you what's possible, but you're gonna have to do the work. And with that, that's. That's where my next question comes up. What kind of leader do you.

Yvonne Heimann [00:25:31]:
Do you see yourself being? What is that? That impact that you are having in your community with your clients?

Gabs Hayes [00:25:41]:
The favorite way that I describe this, and it came directly from someone who's in my community, she called me one day and she said, I just want to say thank you. And I'm like, okay, let's talk about it. She said, there is a space with you that I can be more vulnerable and more open with you than I can with anyone else in this world. And she's like, I don't know how to put my finger on it. I don't know how to explain it, but I just can. And that does numbers for your business. Because when you're an entrepreneur, look like you're saying, Yvonne, we could give you all the dang strategies in the world, but it is your mind, it is your heart, it is your soul, and all of that stuff matters. So for me, when I think about the way I lead and the legacy I want to lead, both with my kids and with this business that I'm building and the community I'm building is, did I create a safe enough space where people could be themselves, as raw, as real, as ugly as we are sometimes, but also as freaking proud and excited and celebratory as we are, because life is fucking meant to be celebrated.

Gabs Hayes [00:26:47]:
And I want to make sure that people feel like they can do both when I'm in their world

Yvonne Heimann [00:26:54]:
Just holding space, no judgment. None of us is perfect. I fucking love that yes. One of the best testimonials to get, one of. One of the best feedbacks to get where it's like, you know what? I can just be all of me, no matter if that's on a crappy day or a yes, I did this day. Yeah, yeah, that's. That's my kind of leader. What. What do you do for you to be able to hold that space? What is that mindset work that up level that you have done so you can be that leader to really hold that space, too? Hey, often enough coming back to the bad, to the dark side of coaching, often enough I see coaches really just, hey, this is how I did it.

Yvonne Heimann [00:27:49]:
And they just talk at their clients or it's like, you just have this conversion rate. How is that? It's supposed to be bigger, bringing, you know, yes, we need to work with numbers. Yes, we want to grow. Yes. But being able to do that in a way that your clients and your community still feel safe. What. What are some of the things that you do to maybe have been able to get here, but also be able to just have the energy and be able to hold that space?

Gabs Hayes [00:28:21]:
Yeah. I mean, for me, I will say I've been on for four years straight now a really, I would say a war path of my own identity. I have been willing to strip every last bit of it back. I've not been married to or attached to any of it anymore. And I remember I was working with a life coach, and I said to her, I said, I'm concerned. My husband, I've been together 20 years. And I said, I'm actually concerned at this point that I'm going to, like, grow apart from my husband. I'm growing to such a different human being.

Gabs Hayes [00:28:52]:
And, you know, she looked me dead in my eyes and she said, and you have to be okay with that. And not only was it with my husband, but I realized I had to be okay with that, with myself. And I am. I almost literally look at old pictures of myself, and I don't recognize her. I do not recognize who that human being is. And I'm not saying that everyone who wants to be a successful business owner needs to completely lose everything that they are. But I did have to strip away all of those shoulds and those, you know, identities and those masks that I put on to fit into someone else's mold. And so some of those tactical things that that is for me is I found breath work to be incredibly helpful for me.

Gabs Hayes [00:29:35]:
I've tried meditation. I've tried tapping. I didn't really resonate with those, but breath work was something I could resonate with. I also used to joke like I was gonna die in the mountains in a cabin with the snow falling. But I moved to Phoenix and I'm like, I think I turned into a lizard. And I like the. So, like, I'm outside all the time and I've noticed if I get to be like a witch, I'm like, oh, I better go outside. I think I haven't seen the sun in a while.

Gabs Hayes [00:29:58]:
I just need to go breathe some fresh air. And so, like, really, it's. I have been unapologetic that I need space for me and that I'm not a robot. I cannot go 24/7. And so I step outside, I take a deep breath. I, you know, I just soak up the sun. I just. I am a human being.

Gabs Hayes [00:30:17]:
Like, I don't. I know that seems so simple, but, like, I just let myself be a human being. You know, I let myself go lay in my bed when I want to lay in my bed. I just, you know, it's like I've just really taken a step back. And it's not to say I've made a million more dollars because I let myself rest or it's not to, you know, necessarily tell you that's the direct dotted line. But what I can say is the energy in which I show up in my business is a different energy. And when I say that I'm doing the greatest work of my career, it's because I gave space to get to that point I have with that big, deep breath. It's perfect.

Yvonne Heimann [00:30:57]:
Mic drop. Mic drop. And for everybody listening or watching, I had no idea. If, you know, we don't script any podcasts, this is. We never know where the conversation is taking us. And I had a rough idea on where you might take it just by the personality. And I'm like, yep, I know why I. I know why I have the women that I have on my podcast.

Yvonne Heimann [00:31:21]:
Because we paid the dues. We paid the dues to learn the lessons. So everybody watching or listening, if you haven't had to pay these dues, please let us pay the dues and just take the lessons. And with that, Gabs, where. Where can people find you? Where can they connect with you? Where can they people. We only online stalk and only on public profiles. But where can people go stalk you and connect with you?

Gabs Hayes [00:31:54]:
Yep. So I have a podcast called Overwhelmed and over it, and that is for all of us who, you know, I mean, the name says it all. And I do quick 10 minute pocket sized episodes, so that way you can grab and follow along quick each week. And then Also I'm on LinkedIn. So I'm @Gabs Hayes on LinkedIn and I share the reality, the ups and downs of all of this journey. So happy to connect with anyone there as well.

Yvonne Heimann [00:32:15]:
So go reach out to Gabs and one of the things that you also going to find in the description is Gabs has a monthly free entrepreneur circle. You're going to find the link for that also in the description. We're going to make sure you have that easily available to you because I'm all for connecting, I'm all for learning that we are not alone in this. So I love the idea of that monthly entrepreneur circle and just connecting with people, just coming in and go find her. Thanks so much love for coming on, sharing your journey, sharing all of this with me. I might just going to have to be in your inbox on getting a couple more digital nomad taps from you.

Gabs Hayes [00:33:00]:
Know where to find me.

Yvonne Heimann [00:33:02]:
Enjoy Phoenix. Right now I'm going to be following you. Let's see where maybe, maybe at some point our paths cross and everybody listening and watching, make sure you hit that follow button because Gabs is just the beginning of some amazing ladies that are coming on to the podcast, bringing all the knowledge. You've just seen it, you've just heard it. We've got some really amazing women on the podcast, so make sure you don't miss out on it. Gabs, thanks so much for joining me and I hope our paths are going to cross in the future in person someday.

Gabs Hayes [00:33:38]:
Absolutely. Thank you so much. I'll talk to you soon.

Yvonne Heimann [00:33:41]:
Bye everybody.